Revo-Ray New Member Posts:8  
| 7/30/2009 8:45 PM |
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I hate to bring up the continuation thing again, but, the least the author could do is contact the previous author and find out about the ending. They go from having a kick ass military vehicle to driving a school bus. I am sure there are a few months in advance that the first chapter if not the first paragraph or even at the least the vehicle type and or place can be changed before it goes to print.
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BKSFLDR8RMANNew Member Posts:43 
| 7/30/2009 8:59 PM |
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Just got this one also.
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One Eyed Vengeance (Leonidas) Basic Member Posts:337 
| 7/31/2009 10:53 AM |
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Well fellas,
I had high hopes for this one as I was reading it while in the bathroom(I do all my best reading there)lol!
I was enjoying the book until I hit page 110 or so and noticed the author continually describing the guns that were mounted on the vehicles as SMG's.He uses the term SMG about a dozen times to describe the guns mounted on the vehicles which are being used against the other vehicles.
An SMG= "sub machine gun"!The weapons described could only possibly be light/medium or heavy machine guns like an M60,an M249 Saw or a medium M240 or a heavy 50.cal.Maybe a russian PPK or a 12.7 MM heavy machine gun.
According to the authors terminology they have Uzi 9mm's or Tommy gun's(.45 cal)strapped to every wag and are using these tiny hand to hand close subguns to blow vehicles apart?
I quit reading the book and used it for toilet paper instead.
This may not seem like a big deal to some,but this,couples with what one of my friends said here about the story starting off with them in a bus with no continuity from the last book is just too much.
I hate to say it but I thin k I am close to giving up on DL.
I bet Laurence James is rolling over in his grave! "Molon Labe"........"Come And Take Them"
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Ron MilesWebsite Owner  Commander In Chief Posts:864 
| 7/31/2009 9:19 PM |
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Posted By Revo-Ray on 30 Jul 2009 08:45 PM
I hate to bring up the continuation thing again, but, the least the author could do is contact the previous author and find out about the ending. They go from having a kick ass military vehicle to driving a school bus. I am sure there are a few months in advance that the first chapter if not the first paragraph or even at the least the vehicle type and or place can be changed before it goes to print.
The basic problem is that the publication order can (and does) change. In fact, Alan related a while back how he got burned exactly because of that, he tried to create some book-to-book continuity between Apocalypse Unborn and Sunspot, and then their release order got switched. He wound up being criticized right here on the board for lack of continuity because the companions encountered the scagworms in Sunspot, and then when they see them in Apocalypse Unborn they act like they have never seen them before - because the books were written with the intention of AU being published first. Another example: I just finished reading the manuscript for Doom Helix. (One of the perks of running the website for more than a dozen years is that I occasionally get my hands on advance materials.) The book was completed months ago, and it isn't even on the publication schedule yet that I am aware of. It will not be out until at least next year, and possibly not until 2011 depending on what the backlog is like. Who knows? Given that writers-for-hire blow deadlines all the time (sorry writer dudes, but you know it's true), and in fact is it not unheard of for a writer-for-hire to take the advance and then NEVER turn in the manuscript, the publishers can't reliably set a publication schedule until they have the finished manuscript in hand. That being the case, book to book continuity is a very difficult thing. I wish it wasn't the case. The golden years when LJ was writing every book, and as such was able to have strong continuity and story arcs, those are long behind us. It's just a different beast now, more's the pity. "Sadly then I knew the answer. All her life she was a dancer, but no one ever played the song she knew." - The Residents
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Bury The SunNew Member Posts:94 
| 8/1/2009 10:03 AM |
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...well, I am an LJ lover, but I am what you might call a post-LJ reader... one of the things I really liked about the books when I first started reading them -Salvation Road- was the NON-continuity! Strange right? As I got more into the books, I found that I wanted more continuity, but then realized that I would have to find all of the books by LJ if I wanted something like that... as a latecomer, it was cool to feel like I didn't have to worry about what had happened in the first 50 books or so... but now, I crave some semblance of order... who knows, maybe an eccentric millionaire will randomly select my name from the phonebook and I'll be able to afford the first 33 eh? lol...
Sun
"Better to have weapons and not need them, than to not have weapons when you do need them." -Trader
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| 8/1/2009 12:26 PM |
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Book to book continuity didn't compleately vanish after Laurence James left DL even though it had been turned over to multiple authors...Stoneface picks up right after Eclipse At Noon, Bitter Fruit has a referance to Stoneface, Mars Arena mentions the events of Demons of Eden, Watersleep refers to Mars Arena, Nightmare Passage picks up right after Watersleep and even refers to Skydark and Freedom Lost picks up right after Nightmare Passage.
I think Way of the Wolf and Dark Emblem have a thread of book to book continuity...it didn't get totally lost until the Baronies trilogy.
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One Eyed Vengeance (Leonidas)Basic Member Posts:337
| 8/3/2009 10:03 AM |
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Yeah Raboy you do have a point.Mark Ellis did a great job with maintaining continuity.If by some miracle we could only get him back on the series?...............I really do miss the LJ formula of jumping from redoubts and then cautiously exploring them until they went outside and got into some adventures before making it back for an escape jump.Take a book like "Blood Lines and compare it to "Dessolation Crossing".(there is no comparison really is there?)
"Molon Labe"........"Come And Take Them"
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DiabloBasic Member Posts:125 
| 8/8/2009 2:47 AM |
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I dont know about this one.....Seein a writer bitch about money...Maybe we should pay more for the books.Yea lets do that.Lets pay 10$ for the next DL's book.(shakes his head)
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skullspliterNew Member Posts:63 
| 8/8/2009 9:56 AM |
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OK just got done reading this one. I thought it was all right i liked having trader back I'ven if it was in flashback mod.  . As for the SMG dept i think the writer was trying to say Small Machine Gun. I know I know it means Sub gun but that is the only idea that makes sense to me ,now if he put LMG or MMG in place of SMG you guys get it. Still i liked it and boy does Jak have a arm  |
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)3az )3aziahBritish Bloke  Veteran Member Posts:1060 
| 8/8/2009 12:14 PM |
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Posted By skullspliter on 08 Aug 2009 09:56 AM
OK just got done reading this one. I thought it was all right i liked having trader back I'ven if it was in flashback mod.. As for the SMG dept i think the writer was trying to say Small Machine Gun. I know I know it means Sub gun but that is the only idea that makes sense to me ,now if he put LMG or MMG in place of SMG you guys get it. Still i liked it and boy does Jak have a arm
Maybe as has been said here before by Mark the author wrote LMG or MMG (or even HMG) and the (line)editor thought it was a spelling mistake and changed to to SMG simply because they knew what that meant but didn't understand or recognise the others ? =============================== Billy Fish: He wants to know if we are gods.
Peachy Carnehan: Not gods - Englishmen. The next best thing.
Please check out my FLICKR photos
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One Eyed Vengeance (Leonidas)Basic Member Posts:337
| 8/8/2009 8:56 PM |
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You gentlemen both make good points.Hell,he could have just said "machine guns" and it would have come across better to me than SMG which is proper terminology for "Sub Machine Gun".
All the gun talk aside,I just finished it and thought it was another pile of shit and a stain on the DeathLands series(I am close to quitting reading again).
Let's forget I am gun nut and all about the firearms screwups ok?The book sucked (IMO)because their is simply no charecterization(hate to keep refering to LJ,but....)The characters do not come off as they should like they did in the LJ day's or even early post LJ.For instance Ryan has a quick temper and "The Red Mist"(where is that?).Also Ryan used to be the main character and alot of the stories were using his inner thoughts to tell the tale?Jak is no longer the same.Doc is not the crazy eccentric he should be,etc....Also the LJ formula of making Mat Trans jumps and exploring the redoubts etc.has been replaced with a much lamer "convoy"type theme.It's almost as if they want to bring back the Trader and his War wag day's but are failing miserably???
Any thoughts on this anyone???? "Molon Labe"........"Come And Take Them"
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)3az )3aziahBritish Bloke Veteran Member Posts:1060
| 8/9/2009 5:59 PM |
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I often wonder if abreviations like SMG and such are used to replace three words when the word / page count of a book exceeds the limit set down by the publisher ? If you used the phrase Sub Machine Gun say ten times in a book replacing it with the abreviation would reduce the word count by 20 (providing they counted SMG as one word that is !)
This si not the worst DL book I've read in a while but also not the best, I like the idea of giving us more back story to J.B, my second favorite in the series. I think out of all the companions him and Krysty have the least known history.
=============================== Billy Fish: He wants to know if we are gods.
Peachy Carnehan: Not gods - Englishmen. The next best thing.
Please check out my FLICKR photos
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One Eyed Vengeance (Leonidas)Basic Member Posts:337
| 8/9/2009 8:07 PM |
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I agree with you about getting the backstory on J.B.,Jim.
And you probably are right about the whole SMG thing too.
All that aside I was still very bored while reading this and dissapointed as well.
Sure it is not the worst DL book,but I gotta keep referencing how inferior the writing is(IMO)compared to guy's like LJ or Mark Ellis.Or Allan Phillipson.
"Molon Labe"........"Come And Take Them"
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JettaManDanBasic Member Posts:252 
| 8/10/2009 1:48 PM |
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i guess i'm just in theminority that likes all the books reguardless of the story or the continunity or the relevance...i've been into them from the beginning and just glad they are still coming.....if you accept that there are so many books nad they are bing written by various authors, all bring in different style and ways of highlinting the story....as usual for me i devoured this book in liek 3 hours...sure some of the backstory was filler - but have we ever really gotten the JB story? not really..the past coming back to haunt him was an interesting twist to me...but as Ron said if books are being publihed out of order due ot whatever reason..thn continuity goes out the windo...
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ScourgeNew Member Posts:65 
| 8/10/2009 7:39 PM |
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Well I just finished this book as well. I agree not the worst but not the best either. Not sure about the use of SMG - it is a fairly common abbreviation within the gun comunity, much like CPU among the 'puter folks. While it is not in everyday usage - within this genre it should be pretty obvious. If the publisher was trying to cut back on word count well that would seem to me to be a shoddy way of doing it. While I am not too worried about absolute continuity, some would be nice so we can keep things straight. I keep hoping with the several authors we would see more locations across the globe not just USA, Mexico and Canada. The foray into Russia was nice but I would like to see some action in China as well.
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One Eyed Vengeance (Leonidas)Basic Member Posts:337
| 8/10/2009 7:59 PM |
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Thanks for mentioning that you noticed the SMG thing too man.I can't help it but I kept seeing an HK MP5 or an Uzi strapped to the wags.LOL!!!Would it have been so hard for the writer to say "M60" "M240""M249" or Lmg?Even a 50 cal.?All that aside I still say all these books suck hard compared to the first 33 books.I am sorry but I am an LJ purist.(even though he screwed up alot of the gun info too)I loved his writing style and he made you "see" into Ryans head and the other group members!(Mark Ellis was great too) "Molon Labe"........"Come And Take Them"
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)3az )3aziahBritish Bloke Veteran Member Posts:1060
| 8/10/2009 8:31 PM |
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=============================== Billy Fish: He wants to know if we are gods.
Peachy Carnehan: Not gods - Englishmen. The next best thing.
Please check out my FLICKR photos
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One Eyed Vengeance (Leonidas)Basic Member Posts:337
| 8/11/2009 1:54 AM |
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Well put Jim!
"Molon Labe"........"Come And Take Them"
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ScourgeNew Member Posts:65
| 8/11/2009 3:22 PM |
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I guess the Uzi and MP-5 are very iconic weapons that even the most obtuse person may recognize. Both are excellent weaps even if the Uzi is a bit over-built but I have never had a Uzi or MP-5 jam when I needed it the most. There are millions of them running around out there so I guess they would be fairly common. I would like to see a more eccletic mix of weapons in a movie but not some BS Hollywood made-up plastic POS like some cheesy SciFi flick.
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One Eyed Vengeance (Leonidas)Basic Member Posts:337
| 8/11/2009 4:30 PM |
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I agree man.You know where I first learned how to recognize almost any Nato or Warsaw pact small arms?Get ready to laugh.I was 8 yrs old and read GI-Joe comics and played with the 3 3/4 inch figures(who all for the most part came with a very genuine looking weapon and an accurate description.I was the only kid in Catholic grade school who knew that an UZI fired 9MM and that an M 16 fired .223(5.56mm)Of course this may sound silly but I think that my obsession/love of guns(other than it being the only thing my father shared w/me)is because of my childhood playing army with a plastic Uzi and an M16 and reading those comics.
"Molon Labe"........"Come And Take Them"
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